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Noz3001
I'm a spammer
 Reputation: 26
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 6220
Location: /dev/null
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 Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| Kaspersky wrote: | | MegaForum wrote: | C++. you can do things like autoclick, autokey clicker or w/e stuff like that.  |
You can do it with every lang, lolz. |
Make me one in SQL then.
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DeletedUser14087
I post too much
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Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 3069
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| Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:36 am Post subject: |
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| noz3001 wrote: | | Kaspersky wrote: | | MegaForum wrote: | | C++. you can do things like autoclick, autokey clicker or w/e stuff like that. |
You can do it with every lang, lolz. |
Make me one in SQL then. |
Don't know SQL very well (i do know abit cause i made that MU server,lol)
but with SQL you can't, it's not a programming lang.
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Gthuggin
Grandmaster Cheater
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Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 862
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| Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:03 pm Post subject: |
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make it in c++ and it will be easy!
just figure out how to bypass win32 API's by hopping over gameguards little 5 byte hook...
thats all they do for usermode hooks! just a little jump!
don't think you need to write a driver to send messages to a minimized window... because you don't
gameguard made their little hook on postmessagea and I say fuck you jump im not gonna follow you, instead ill just go right over ya!
yeah but first u need to execute the original 5 bytes
| Code: |
mov edi,edi
push ebp
mov ebp,esp
jmp PostMessageA+5
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lolz im just trying to give you an idea here, that wont actually work, youll have to put some thought into it!
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TerryDonahugh
Master Cheater
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Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 412
Location: .nl
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| Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| appalsap wrote: | Terry:
You can set some dirty switches and hacks to strip away features you don't need but you lose functionality typical of a program using extended C++ features. GCC probably optimized the class out, turning retort() into a function of it's own, seeing that sClass only had one function - this is not typical of standards-compliant C++ compilers.
Also, based on the sizes I can make a good guess he uses MSVC, which by default statically links in the C/C++ library where GCC doesn't, so the bloat doesn't go directly into your executable; it's hidden in shared libraries. |
The generated asm listing does not support your claims of g++ optimizing the class out. As far as standards compliance goes with C++ compilers I would say g++ is more compliant than MSVC. Then again, I have not touched MSVC since version 7.1.
It is quite obvious that gcc links dynamically against the crt by default and MSVC does not hence the remark that someone failed to set the compiler settings 'properly'  (I have spent quite some time writing small C apps using MSVC)
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Pseudo Xero
I post too much
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Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Posts: 2607
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| Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Kaspersky wrote: | | noz3001 wrote: | | Kaspersky wrote: | | MegaForum wrote: | | C++. you can do things like autoclick, autokey clicker or w/e stuff like that. |
You can do it with every lang, lolz. |
Make me one in SQL then. |
Don't know SQL very well (i do know abit cause i made that MU server,lol)
but with SQL you can't, it's not a programming lang. |
Yes it is.
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| haxory' wrote: | can't VB do anything??
windows is programmed using VB right? correct me if im wrong.
so all things in windows you have like the start menu is a windows form too. |
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Flyte
Peanuts!!!!
 Reputation: 6
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 1887
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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| TerryDonahugh wrote: | | It is quite obvious that gcc links dynamically against the crt by default and MSVC does not hence the remark that someone failed to set the compiler settings 'properly' (I have spent quite some time writing small C apps using MSVC) |
That is your opinion, I would rather have my exe's be able to function on their own without more than the necessary .dlls.
Also, the code was for comparison, if you expected me to link C++ dynamically and not C, you are very biased. The static linking was to show ALL of the overhead C++ generates.
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PedraSimon
Master Cheater
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Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 368
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| Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:27 am Post subject: |
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First of all, C++ has more fats than C. period.
However, they are not all bad cholesterols. Alot of the STL stuff are interlinked. use a simple cout, and suddenly the exe file ballooned.
If one, for small apps, carefully avoid those STL classes, the exe bloat can be managed. My trainer, written entirely in c++, does not use any STL classes, is a manageable 35k. I believe, the equivalent C program may be 50% smaller, ASM 70% smaller, both much faster than c++ version. But they would take ALOT longer to develop, and wont be as easy to maintain.
C++ and C are good for different thing. It is pointless to argue which one is better without stating the comparison criteria.
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appalsap
Moderator
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Joined: 27 Apr 2006
Posts: 6753
Location: Pakistan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 3:27 am Post subject: |
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| x0r wrote: | | SUCH AN ORIGINAL THREAD, C++/C DEBATE! |
It's not original in that a newbie is asking a question, "which language would do the best job, I want to do x." Usually when one asks the question, they are new to programming in general, so it's only fair to warn the prey (fresh mind) about the predator (C++ zealot trying to force people into using *the* one programming paradigm they think is best), showing them that there are other options.
There are those who also mistakenly recommend C++ because they do not realize they are not using C++ exclusive features, but C with a C++ compiler. It is not the language that is dangerous, but the act of forcing your particular style and ideals on others.
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TerryDonahugh
Master Cheater
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Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 412
Location: .nl
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| Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 4:42 am Post subject: |
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xOr: It said Linux zealot and C++ coder. I am not sure what you are aiming at here.
Also, in no way my intentions were anything else than showing that both C and C++ executables could produce smaller executables than said. Which although kind of a moot point is far from being zealot.
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PedraSimon
Master Cheater
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Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 368
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| Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 6:44 am Post subject: |
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| x0r wrote: |
[deleted]...
PedraSimon: I won't argue with you because I love you My only issue is that your trainer is only slow for a few reasons (using stdlib, using msvcrt APIs [(p)rintf, (s)scanf, etc) which rape your program's speed but you are slowly changing your methods (or so I think, going on the last conversation we had in this regard).
[deleted]... |
everything except scanf and strtok has been removed. I will probably remove them soon as I am only using them for fairly simple parsing..
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Pseudo Xero
I post too much
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Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Posts: 2607
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| Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 6:53 am Post subject: |
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Well... according to Wikipedia, it is. But I guess you're right, it's not a fully-featured language. It's only for accessing data.
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| haxory' wrote: | can't VB do anything??
windows is programmed using VB right? correct me if im wrong.
so all things in windows you have like the start menu is a windows form too. |
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